Brad Ideas - Is Versed being used for torture? - Comments

What?

anti — Wed, 24 Feb 2010 09:11:05 -0800

Get over it? I didn't demand drugs, quite the contrary I demanded NO drugs. I didn't have anxiety, I DID want to remember the procedure and I wasn't supposed to be under general anesthesia. I see that you are laboring under the delusion that we actually WANT what you describe, in fact demand it! The GFY comment is typical of todays anesthesia providers and Versed is the GFY drug isn't it? I hope everybody who reads your post realizes that anesthesia providers are hostile to their patient. Versed is used for their GFY moments with the hapless and helpless patients. The truth of the matter isn't that "all patients need something to complain about." The truth of the matter is that there are people like you that have a GFY attitude, don't listen to what patients are saying to you, and feel animosity and disdain for your patients! You have a drug in your arsenal which is detrimental to the patient and yet you use it. We complain about it and you say GFY! Nice...

Get over it

Anastakid — Wed, 27 Jan 2010 23:22:23 -0800

Wow am I sick and tired of you people. You decide you need help, you consent to treatment and demand drugs to help you then question the manner in which we provide you help. Patients are given Versed BECAUSE IT'S THE SAFEST INDUCTION AGENT for them. If you were given Dip instead you would need to be intubated and on a vent, but I suppose you would complain about a sore throat or raspy voice then. the truth of the matter is all patients need something to complain about. Even with a 5 star rating on a survey there's always the line "the only thing that I didn't like was...". Get over yourself and realize that you didn't want the anxiety, you didn't want to remember the procedure, and you didn't want to be aware under anasthesia. Why don't you look up anasthesia awareness in between your complaint sessions and understand that with the right drug (Versed) you'll never be aware or at least not remember it. You want to talk dangerous drugs? APAP is absolutely terrible and according to a FDA report looking at the years 1990 to 2001: 26,000 people are hospitalized and 458 die each year from acetaminophen overdoses. It is the number one cause of acute liver failure in the United States. Now chew on that and GFY.

Versed& colonoscopy

Bee — Mon, 11 Jan 2010 23:58:50 -0800

i also had versed for a colonoscopy. I remember vividly begging them to stop becauyse I was hurting so bad! I didn't know if I was verbally saying this or trying to say it& could not. It freaked me out, because they never stopped. At one point I remember lifting my head to look at the monitor& it showed my BP being 138/94. I started the colonoscopy w/a BP of 90/60, which is my norm. If they are monitoringme& see I am in distress w. a higher BP& heart rate, why not give me something else? This has haunted me!
When I asked the DR, she mentioned I moaned a few times& I don't believethat& also said the next colonoscopy, she will make sure she gets a anesthesiologist in the room. Doesn't that say- without saying she knew I was in distress??

Versed

Anonymous — Fri, 04 Sep 2009 08:58:55 -0700

I have been tortured with this drug 4 times. Each time was by a PAIN DOCTOR!! Eight days following the third time, I suffered from 2 strokes. Every Neurologist that I had seen for the strokes denied that the procedure caused the strokes, but at the same time, none of them could tell me what did cause the strokes. I was a 46 year old woman when that happened. Even though they "could not find the cause", it was back to that same old mindset of "blame the patient", and "protect our own". Versed is a horrible drug. The doctors that use it deny that anything they do while using it is painful, and they try to make you think you are crazy and dreaming the pain up. I don't understand why when there are so many of us out there that have suffered so much as a result of this drug that it has not been banned by the FDA. I would suggest that anyone who has suffered from the use of this drug, and lack of pain meds during an invasive procedure report this to the FDA. This is a barbaric and horrendous way to treat human beings, to give them an amnesiac drug and torture them. I didn't get the amnesiac effect, and the doctors lied their butts off, denying that the burning of the sensory nerves in my back was painful. This was 2 different PAIN MANAGEMENT DOCTORS that did this to me. I have not been able to receive adequate help for the chronic pain that I deal with 24/7 from my ribcage down. I was lied to, and told that they had to keep me awake while they were doing this because they needed to communicate with me during the procedure. The last time the doctor never uttered a single word to me, not before, not during, and not afterwards. Not even a drop dead or kiss my behind. I now struggle often to keep from committing suicide because I can find no help for the constant pain I am in, and the feelings of violation related to the barbaric treatment I was given.

As far as colonoscopies go, my son was given one, and I could hear the screaming all the way down the hall. I was unable to help him, and was told by one of the nurses that the doctor had not waited for the drugs to take effect. I found that a**hole out side of the hospital and confronted him. He lied through his teeth. I suspect that same "wonder drug" versed was used on my son as well. People need to speak out and help get this drug banned. You don't know when it's liable to be used on you or a loved one again. As has been stated here by others, they will use it against your consent and against your will.

Helpful?

Anonymous — Fri, 04 Sep 2009 05:07:38 -0700

Why don't you people define "helpful?" Helpful for what? No seriously, what is helpful about this little poison? Who does it help and help them what? If you want to be relaxed there are other drugs that don't feature PTSD as a side effect. So what else? Do you thing PTSD forever is something that is helpful? Is it worth the mental anguish that this drug causes for the patient? Only if you have Narcissitic Personality Disorder and you think you are a God. The truth is that you are not omniscient, you don't know what the patient wants unless you ask, and you certainly aren't going to ask the stupid ignorant patient anything are you. Admit it, YOU medical people like to use this drug and it doesn't have a damn thing to do with helping the patient. Obviously if you can't be truthful about the effects of this absolutely hideous drug, you will never admit REAL reason you use this drug, which is for YOUR OWN SELFISH REASONS.

Living Cadaver

Anonymous — Fri, 04 Sep 2009 04:56:57 -0700

Unfortunately I was also given Versed so that the Medical Center could use me as a teaching tool. I had so many student nurses practice putting a Foley catheter in me for no reason that I got a kidney infection. The hospital denies this, but there it is in the notes "catheter went in easily? Y Even my surgeon was obviously a beginner. Or the janitor was allowed to take a go at it! I had arm surgery, not open heart and these people had no reason to give me Versed. I have PTSD as well from the horror of being turned into a compliant lump. Don't you just LOVE how medical people pretend that this drug is "for our own good?" If it was for our own good and everybody just totally NEEDS this drug, it's a WONDERFUL medication etc. Then why the hell don't they tell us about it before hand? HMMM? Could it be that we would all be refusing this drug?

Versed is helpful?

Anonymous — Wed, 26 Aug 2009 07:14:01 -0700

Very helpful and safe drug for the person on the giving end. If you are on the receiving end, know this, this drug is a nasty evil poison which helps medical personnel only. It isn't for you baby, its for the convenience and entertainment of snotty, uncaring staff. If you knew how these sadists treat you after they think that you have amnesia you would want to knock the crap out of their laughing faces.

Versed being used for torture

Anonymous — Mon, 24 Aug 2009 18:49:52 -0700

With all due respect, I think your issues go beyond PTSD. Perhaps you did have hallucinations as a result of being given Versed and a narcotic pain med (its been known to happen) but I find it very hard to believe that you were "medically raped" by gangs of male health care workers on 2 seperate occasions. As for your herpes break out, lesions usually don't appear that quickly. Believe me I mean no disrespect, nor do I mean to mock your pain; I just think there has to be another reason for all these events.

Versed

Anonymous — Mon, 24 Aug 2009 18:10:08 -0700

Versed is one of many types of sedatives used for pre-op or endoscopic procedures. In our area, it is not commonly used for this purpose. MD's here prefer to use lorazepam or diazapam. Versed can have a number of disturbing side effects, but so can many other drugs. I have known people who suffered serious side effects from antihistamines, blood pressure meds , antidepressant meds, morphine, Demerol etc..... Many doctors will offer another sedative if you refuse Versed; you must be persistant , you have the right to refuse. Also, sedatives are given to relax the central nervous system, which in turn cause relaxation of the smooth muscles, making endoscopic procedure easier to perform and to tolerate. Could anyone imagine having a colonoscopy without a sedative? Not a pleasant thought. Versed is not an analgesic, it has a sedative effect in low doses, and a hypnotic(sleep) effect in higher doses. Versed has recieved a lot of negative press lately since it was one of the drugs found in Michael Jackson's system (very high doses given I.V.) but given correctly for its intended purpose, it is a very helpful and safe drug.

Versed imobilility

Deane — Fri, 10 Jul 2009 06:19:52 -0700

You are wrong; I just got midazolam .05mg/kg (4mg) for a routine colonoscopy; I was imobile, unable to speak or move and unfortunately the gastro looped the scope and perforated my colon. I could have warned her, but Versed prevented this. What a lousy drug, and I am a physician. It's certianly no Long Island Iced-tea. I haven't met an anesthesia provider who uses this drug on a routine basis; we are a 450 bed university hospital.

Morticia-versed DID work for you!

Anonymous — Sat, 04 Jul 2009 20:05:22 -0700

The did the exam quickly and got you out the door.......to hell with your pain, anxiety, memory loss, nightmares, PTSD.....big secret: the GI doc doesn't care....and he/she would NEVER consent to Versed.......next time write on the consent: I'm not consenting to sedation, painkiller only-make them sign it or hire anesthesia to give propofol...it's total sedation (killed michael jackson) but even a nurse anesthesia person can give it safely. Call your former gastro, be polite until you actually get him/her on the line and tell them what really happened to you-and remind them it's thier fault-then hang up.

Versed did not work for me

Morticia — Sat, 16 May 2009 16:45:55 -0700

I had a colonoscopy four days ago and was given Demerol and Versed and had been told that it would be painless and that I would not remember a thing. Not so! I was aware of every painful detail, of what the Dr and medical staff were talking about, I was watching the numbers on the monitor and I remember begging for more meds but being told that my BP was too low, I'd just have to deal with it. The pain was excruciating and what was even worse, a few hours after I got home - feeling fine, no grogginess, could have driven myself, did not need a nap - I started to get flashbacks of the horrible, painful details. Also have felt a lot of livid rage at the Dr who did the procedure and my own Dr for not telling me of the side effects of Versed. My friends who have already had colonoscopies had said that the prep was the bad part, the procedure was easy but not so with me. Fortunately, my report was good as I NEVER intend to have another and will never take Versed again. My Dr is concerned that I may have PTSD and I am a healthy person, both physically and mentally, take no medications, always sleep well, but now I have flashbacks and nightmares.

Versed for colonoscopy

Luis — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 10:31:55 -0700

Versed and colonoscopy... Just a few days ago I had a colonoscopy. The report says: Midazolam 4+2+1 mg, Petidin 50+50 mg.

What I remember: To scream... To scream a lot and loud, and not being able to move.
I'm not the screaming type of guy. What were they doing? Will they treat me that way if they new I was able to remember afterwards? No way! They do it because they want to do it quickly...

Don't use versed. If you want to use it ask to be with a friend or familly!

Is Versed being used for torture?

Kali — Thu, 16 Apr 2009 19:25:42 -0700

Ah yes, Komboa, too true. Bush and Cheney instituted ever more open advocacy of torture right til the end. Secret prisons exist right here in the US, I've seen the proof, heard interviews with at least 1 "inmate"; this has been going on since the 70s. We don't even need to cite Guantanamo, those in Europe, as well as the horrors built in various states of the "3rd" world.

So we're gonna worry about "Versed"? Aside from the fact that its a shitty little drug and administered for MD convenience, it barely merits a mention. Of course they can use Versed. I'm just of the opinion that Versed is nothing compared to what they've developed since that little tool.

Go read "informed" consent laws.

Anonymous — Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:41:41 -0800

It clearly states that it is the medical providers job to reveal all to the patient, not the patient's duty to extract information from medical practicioners. Medical people are deliberately obfuscating the issue by infering that it is the patients fault for not knowing what they don't know. It's on YOU the drug slammer to tell the patient what the patient would consider necessary information, like amnesia and unnatural obedience. You guys are super careful not to disclose pertinant information because you know damn good and well that we patients would object if we were given all the facts.

Is Versed being used for torture?

brad — Mon, 14 Jun 2004 09:00:01 -0700

Here’s my most disturbing idea yet. There are drugs which erase memory (or rather block the formation of memories while they are used.) It seems disturbingly probable to me that these might be being used for torture. Espcially considering the light of new memos giving the US the green light for torture.

If you don’t know of this class of drugs, you may have heard of “Roofies” the “date rape” drug which have been used to both make a victim pliable and also to make her forget the rape. There are stronger drugs, such as Versed, which are used in surgery.

The surgical use is quite disturbing. They want to perform a procedure on you while you will be somewhat conscious, but it is painful and upsetting and will leave mental scars — so they put you through the pain but block you from remembering it.

However, it must be obvious to those wishing to do torture that this could be applied here too. Apply the drug, then apply torture which leaves few permanent marks. The victim would awaken unaware they had been tortured or what they had confessed to. They could not testify later about their torture, they would not even know to.

It’s hard not to think that this would be a more “humane” form of torture, in the same way the surgical use of the drugs is humane. After all, you just want the information, why leave the victim with psychic scars, as there always are from torture. This is frightening because it might make the public much more accepting of torture. And on top of that, how will we ever find out if torture is going on? Only from the torturers themselves.

This is just the start of a trend. Tools like “brain fingerprinting” already exist which cause no pain but examine your brain to find out if you remember something you are being shown, or if it’s the first time you are seeing it. People have already suggested this is so benign as to be suitable for airport screening!

I predict we’ll see newer and “better” torture and interrogation techniques in the near future. Better brain scans. Polygraphs that actually work. More powerful drugs that affect not just memory but compliance. Perhaps eventually nanomachines that reach in and target brain centers to create compliance.

Some of these may already exist — though I think not too many or our intelligence communities would be doing a better job on terrorism than they are.

But they will exist. How will we as a society cope with them? We already seem willing to forget about the prohibitions on torture in the constitution and international law. We’ll pretend the prohibitions don’t even exist for these new forms.

The only way to avoid them will be to work soon for strong laws and eventually an explicit constitutional amendment protecting the right of privacy in our thoughts. And that will be a long time coming.

Update: More stories of Versed and other memory drugs in my new memory tag.